Just throwing out an idea to help with the flood of unwanted, virtually worthless pets AND add a new item that might bring in some more revenue to the site. It would be a big change so probably not something to be considered until the re-vamp, but a possibility!

The idea is basically to give male pets on the site a very short cool-down (say, like one or two hours) after they've been bred. This would help keep people from breeding every female in their stables to a handful of males every three or seven days, since I know many users keep a larger store of females than males because the males can be bred unlimited times. I think this might be especially helpful in terms of new and younger users who flood their hatcheries because breeding and hatching eggs is fun, and then desperately try to sell the pets for one gold to keep them from being released (and help cut back on cheap pets that are bought during the release contests, since so many people are upset when their pets are purchased and then instantly released).

"But Sel!" you're probably thinking right now, "Projects already take ages to complete! This would make max stat and 6vis projects even more tedious and time consuming!"

Yes, I'm aware, which is why I'm also proposing hand in hand with the short cool downs: Male Virility Kits! Both in one-to-five use smaller ones, which could be a drop during fests or a scale-purchase items, or even an AP purchase or a new gold sink, to eliminate the cool down on a chosen male.

And for those doing multiple projects that involve tons of breeding? The Majestic Male Virility Kit could be similar to the test and scan kits, where for 1000-1500 diamonds, you can buy a permanent upgrade that eliminates the male cooldown entirely or works as a function where you can press a button, and instantly all males within the chosen stable are relieved of their cool down (Personally I prefer that option, since it then also gives the option of taking on pets from other users and sending them back without the cooldown, the same way people use test kits).

I'm more than open to critique on the ideas if anyone can spot any possible flaws that haven't occurred to me. ^^ More view points are always preferable.

I don't see how this would negate breeding problems. It wouldn't stop anyone determined to mass-breed, it'd just make them wait a little longer to breed the same mass collection of females to the handful of males as the cooldown is so short. Others might just get more males and then breed more, only to end up with hatcheries full and no stable room to hold them all from having to acquire more males. If anything I can only see it causing more flooding as they try to evict those hatchlings from the hatcheries.

I would also like to point out that making an unlimited kit similar to the genetic testing kit would not be a solution at all.

People can offer to use the kit for anyone just like the genetic testing kit in your hypothetical, but then you have people throwing cooldown removals left and right and males all over the place without cooldowns. All that needs to happen is these cooldown-less males get into the hands of the users who mass-breed and boom, you have the same problem all over again. Mass-breeding breaking out and cheap, virtually worthless pets everywhere.

I don't mean to be rude, I just feel like people would find ways around this which would negate the intended purpose.

One note I feel I should make just to make sure there aren't any hard feelings or things taken too personally...

I don't mean this to sound like anything against you for making the suggestion, Selestial. I do get a little heated on my statements below but it's towards the idea itself, I promise. You did say that you're open to other views so here's some insight from one of the big names in pet projects - and this isn't a view strictly meant for veterans of the game, either; I've actually met a newbie (currently at 5 days) who's starting off with big, 6-vis project goals who is starting from scratch with essences! His thread was set up a couple of days ago. ^^ It gives me hope for the same issue you're addressing, Sel.



But on your suggestion... I've got to give an absolute NO on this one.

This idea will do little to change those who aren't responsible with their pet breeding and want to breed 1000 random pets in a single day. Some players prefer a quantity of randomness rather than a focus on quality. They may be delayed on their numbers, sure, but it won't change the onslaught of dishwater pets and the numerous cries of "Help! I don't have enough space! T^T" Some players will just have to learn the hard way on being responsible with the stables.

What this suggestion would do, is severely punish those who are actually breeding with an end-goal to achieve. From here on I'll be using myself as a prime example; I've gone through probably 100 projects and right now, I'm actively working on about ten. (The first page of my hatchery alone shows 5: Cosmic Glow Ny'vene, as used in an example later, Steampunk Puffadore, Lunar Dreamer Aeridini, Iridescent Qitari, and Bottled Moonlight Lunemara)


My first point: Timing. I have several ongoing projects to complete and I happen to like my eggs' hatching times to be synchronized; it spares me from having to pop on every single hour of the just day to hatch eggs. Between breeding for my projects, hatching about 20-100 eggs in one sitting, sometimes up to 300 eggs if I breed for multiple projects at once, and then searching through those newly hatched pets to weed out the offspring I don't need (which are released immediately, by the way), I'm already spending on average an hour, sometimes two or three hours with each round of project management.

Having to take an extra step to hit a button just because I suddenly can't breed my males would add time to an already long and consuming schedule, or worse, having to stop entirely and come back every two hours just to BREED the pets, and then repeat the same "come back every hour process" again three days later to HATCH those eggs a few at a time would literally make the game unplayable for me. I'm here for my projects first and foremost; it's the first thing I check in the morning.



When it comes to STATS projects in particular, typically it's best to limit your project to TWO males, three if needed, for every available female. It drastically saves on prismatic philters when you have two 1500 hp males rather than having to use those still at 1000 hp just because a cooldown stands in the way.



The same can be said with breeding for RECESSIVE traits, and here's where the worst hit would be. When you want a specific result and one male happens to have all that you need, there's the one you want to breed to all of the ladies. Using other, lesser males would only result in a higher failure rating, and getting the right traits to hatch is already hard enough. I'll even do the math just to prove this point.

As the best example I can point out, I'm working on the Glow genes and Cosmic mutations for the Ny'vene. This male happened to be close enough to Maxed Stats, with all four traits I need but most are still recessives. I've used him for breeding twice, both times with about 20 females each.

Of 40 offspring he has provided, I kept and named only 6. The other 32 were released shortly after hatching because they didn't cover all four traits. And that's with both the male with 4 traits, and the females with at least three as recessives.

That's a measly 15% success rate with his offspring. And still, most of them only show 1-2 of the traits that I need. Only ONE has three of four traits showing with the fourth as a recessive, and this has been a project I've worked towards since the Ny'vene revamp first came out. Just getting pets with all four traits up to Maxed, or almost Maxed, Stats has taken almost a YEAR.

And I'm not exaggerating or throwing numbers around here.

The proof is in the first male I generated to bring the traits in.

I started this project on October 24th of 2016. And it's STILL. NOT. DONE.

It will probably take another 2-3 months of breeding to finish, and that's with careful breeding and extensive care in project management.

Adding a male breeding restriction to a project like this would mean that a 1 year long project would likely take 3 years, maybe even 4 to get the right results. Either that, or a ridiculously insane amount of luck with every round of breeding through the generations which, clearly shown by my example, doesn't usually work out.



Oversized post complete! XD

No worries, Xav, I absolutely hear you! (And of course I'm not going to take offense! A counter argument to a suggestion as long as it's not worded rudely or aggressively is always a good thing) And honestly you were one of the main people on my mind when trying to come up with something to cancel out the idea of a male cooldown, because as the site is already, it's already too much daily work for me to bother with projects and I wouldn't want to make it worse for those breeding towards an end goal like yourself.

The notion of having to come back hour after hour would deter me from even minor breeding projects, which is part of why I think it might be helpful to curb the onslaught of dishwater pets (which is a perfect term btw), though obviously not get rid of them completely. I'm not sure anyone solution could manage that. Some people will always find a way to flood themselves with dishwater pets to then thrust on the market, but I've also seen plenty of claims of 'I just started breeding and it was so fun I went through and bred until I didn't have anything to breed anymore!' and the hourly cool down on males would slow that kind of impulsive breeding, if not eliminate it entirely.

In terms of not wanting to press the button, with the scale of breeding you're working with, I also completely understand. Which is why I also put forth the option of the majestic kit just eliminating the cool down entirely, basically putting breeding back to where it is now for those who spend the diamonds to buy it. Even with the minimal breeding I do, it's still something I'd be willing to pay 10-15 dollars for. I don't have an idea for a solution in terms of breeding to other people's pets, in this case, however, which could be a vital flaw to the suggestion. The main reason I didn't push that option more in the initial post was because I expected cries about 'another paying user exclusive feature!' and 'then it's not accessible in some way to everyone!' and was trying to curb those possible complaints before getting them. ^^

I think my biggest issue with the suggestions is the major emphasis on spending more diamonds.

I'll be completely honest here, I have a very tight budget to work with.

The only reason I can even afford Maxed Stats projects is because I got lucky. I had enough gold saved from themed projects to buy up a few mil worth of prismatic philters when they were 30-50k each on trade broker a few years back. I think I purchased about 50 or 60 prismas that way; stats projects weren't popular yet and the festival at the time was handing them out left and right to people who didn't want them. Now, prismatics are typically going for 150-250k, 150k during festivals only.

With that first investment I got the Ny'vene cleared for stats, their revamp came and I was able to expand my Ny'vene projects, and then I had a steady stream of game currency to keep funding other projects for stats. That, and the occasional boost from designing a themed pet if I got lucky enough. Get a few thousand diamonds selling the "any 2V prize" and sink it all on prismatic philters, occasionally stable space. Sell a few stats pets? Sink it all on prismatic philters. I've had to stop progress on a few species because I can't afford the prismatics for them all. Instead I focus on what's most popular and try to get more income from their pet sales. (Don't worry, Draeyls and Morkkos! I'll get you there one day!!)

I wouldn't be able to drop 10 or 15 bucks on the site until Xmas, if even then. If I had it, of course I would; I love this site! But I have 1800 in bills to pay each month and last time I checked, eating was pretty vital, too.

Not everyone has deep pockets. I may be fairly prominent when it comes to Sylestia but real life ain't quite so grande. If Sylestia ever becomes too "pay to play" then I won't be able to keep up. Can't get on the PC to play the game if I can't pay for the electricity bill, so gaming would be cut first so I can keep the lights on.

Life aside...



After doing the math myself I don't think a male cooldown would change too much. I won't use names or give major hints for where I got my information, of course, but I looked around for big hatcheries of dishwater pets and analyzed the ratio of males to females in ADULTS only, just to make sure that my analysis was sound.

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SpeciesA: 46 females, 40 males. -6 potential eggs, but 40 that could be churned out in regardless.
SpeciesB: 9 females, 15 males. More than enough males to breed them all.
SpeciesC: 42 females, 35 males. -7 potential eggs bred, but 35 bred all the same.

Stables are both 100/100 already, and the hatchery is around 20 pages full.

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For another mass-breeder it was the same thing.

SpeciesA: 56 females. 52 males. Eh, -4 potential eggs, but 52 potential eggs.
SpeciesB: 140 females, 132 males. Eh, -8 eggs, but 132 eggs anyway.

The difference here is that this person has a boatload of stables all full of dishwater pets as far as I could tell. .___.;

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Even with a cooldown on the males, there would be very little impact made, and here's why:

One of the common, baseline problems with mass breeders is that they don't particularly care to organize their pets.

They aren't planning out how to balance their ratio of males to females, they don't have any preferences for which pet breeds with which. Gender results are a 50/50 chance; the pets they'll end up mass-breeding will likely carry through with roughly a 50/50 balance. As long as they continue with their mass-breeding tactic of "I don't give a flooffy Bulbori's tail" then they'll pretty much always have roughly the same number of males and females.

They don't care about "improving" the next generation either, so there's no restriction on which colors, which traits, or even how many traits are deemed worthy of breeding. Anything can and will be bred with anything, even if the results turn out uglier and uglier from the pets that bred them. Bottom line: pretty pet + pretty pet does not always equal a pretty pet, and may instead breed an endless horde of ugly pets.


With everything as it is, if someone WAS to be organized in wanting to breed as many dishwater pets as they possibly could, then they would keep about 5 unrelated males, possibly even down to 2 males, and only keep female offspring for making more eggs when they're older. I've looked around and I don't see that happening. Anyone with a mind to organize would likely come to conclusion of "Hm. Maybe I should make this next generation of pets better in some way."


(That may sound a little harsh towards mass breeders but I'd like to think it's a fair analysis. Granted, this is coming from someone who keeps meticulous notes on every generation in a notebook, tags their breeders with names like "STATS (insert health)" for easy sorting on the advanced search, and releases 80% or more of all pets bred for the project...)