Alright, i have a project started. It's a 3vis nixi, seen here:



The parents are Him, Her, and a third guy Here.

I'm not sure if i put their traits right, they're Regular generated and only have the two slots. on top of this taking FOREVER to get a vis girl from the first pair, i don't know if maybe i screwed up and need more essences or what? i want a pair of vis so i can breed 'em off for a friend(and anyone else who wants one later on), but dear god i'm so new to breeding for a specific result and i'm not sure what i'm doing at all, despite all the helpful tutorials out there.

tl;dr: these(Him, Her, and Here) are the parents, can i get a 3vis PAIR from them? or do i need more essences and a better plan?

ok the second dad's link keeps breaking, so to verify HERE is Male #2

It may not be the most efficient approach but I'd probably start by trying to get a female offspring of 1508231 (female with 2 carry) and 1540427 (male with 1 vis) with the three carries. That female offspring can then be bred with 1508237 (male with 2 carry) and, at best, you'd be able to get 2 vis and 1 carry. That offspring can then be bred back to 1508231 (female with 2 carry) or 1540427 (male with 1 vis) depending on its gender. That generation could then be bred back to one of the original 3 (as applicable) or the first generation of offspring. You can go round and round and round with this.

Alternatively, if you were to breed 1508231 (female with 2 carry) and 1508237 (male with 2 carry) together, as soon as you get a female with at least 1 carry, I'd start breeding that offspring with 1540427 (male with 1 vis).

Subject to space, I'd keep any female offspring with 1 or more trait points. Males, I'd keep a few with 2 trait points and definitely consider "upgrading" (i.e. moving from using those males with less trait points as studs to using those with more trait points) when you come across ones with more than 2 trait points.

It's also probably worth mentioning as well, say you did breed 1508231 (female with 2 carry) and 1540427 (male with 1 vis) and you did get a female with 3 carries, while that offspring ages, you can continue to breed 1508231 (female with 2 carry) with 1540427 (male with 1 vis) or 1508237 (male with 2 carry) to see if you can get any more offspring with a good outcome. It's always useful to have multiple females as you don't need to wait as much.

You should definitely be able to get a breedable pair of 3 vis through this process - you'd just need to make sure that they aren't related. The least efficient but most fool-proof way to do this would be to breed for a single 3 vis (say we call him/her, "Vis1"), then sell / release / don't go anywhere near Vis1's immediate parents / siblings / children and then breed for another 3 vis (which should be fine to breed with Vis1 simply because they'll have no immediate family members in common). That said, depending on how diversified your breeding pool has become, you may be able to breed Vis1 with another of your (not immediately related to Vis1) Nixis, then breed that offspring with another (not immediately related to Vis1) and hypothetically get a 3 vis which could then breed with Vis1.

Ummm I don't know whether that's particularly clear but let me know if I can clarify further :)

Edit 1: For slight error.

Edit 2:
I just took a look through your Hatchery. I would recommend you get these girls tested to confirm if they do have carried traits:
https://www.sylestia.com/view/pets/?petid=1568253 (I wouldn't sell her until you've had her tested to confirm she's no use to your project.)
https://www.sylestia.com/view/pets/?petid=1583156
https://www.sylestia.com/view/pets/?petid=1590223
https://www.sylestia.com/view/pets/?petid=1599013
I'm happy to help with testing, if you'd like.
As a start point, I recommend keeping any that have 1 or more trait points and breeding them with Medic B once they're adults.

Edit 3:
I bought and tested 1568253, sadly, no traits. Happy to give her back to you to sell again if you'd like otherwise I'll release her - let me know.

Yeah, the plan was to breed the A's for a 2vis female, then breed her with B, but that would leave me at three carried offspring...and if i repeat the process, i'd just have a sibling that can't breed anyway...

Unless i keep going with that, as a cycle, and breed 3Carry with A, hope her offspring carries Stubby, then breed with B again? Sorta like a loop around, 'cause pets can breed with their grandparents, right? Doesn't result in a pair though...

I'll try the 'testing of whatever i get' route, esp till i can get a kit myself. I've been saving up for a test kit myself, since i have more projects lined up. (Prolly another stable, too...2000 diamonds oh my god)

Thanks for testing the one girl for me, you can release her if you don't want her! The first offspring had 1vis 1carry OTL

You'd aim to get a 3 carried offspring and then breed him/her with one of the original pets. Incidentally, if you were to breed the two carried together (get a 2 vis) and then breed that 2 vis with the unrelated original pet, you have the option to be able to breed the second generation offspring with a choice between two of the original parents (the grandparents).

You just keep looping around until you get a 3 vis. At some point you'll need to breed a combination of generation 1, generation 2, generation 3, etc Nixis together as you'll never get a 3 vis with the original pets as the immediate parents.

Because you'll never be able to get a 3 vis with the original pets, once you've got your 3 vis, to really simplify things, you could get rid of all generation 1, generation 2, generation 3, etc offspring and "start again" with the original parents. The resulting 3 vis offspring will be related but, but because you'll never get a 3 vis with the original pets as the immediate parents, they won't be that closely related that they can't breed. Does that make sense?

You can run the "start again" process alongside the original breed but you have to keep track of which offspring are there for fullvis1 and which are there for fullvis2, etc.

Happy to help with any testing you might need while you save for a Testing Kit - doesn't matter how many projects - feel free to PM me.

Edit: Just heading out to an appointment but I have an additional comment on the first offspring (1 vis, 1 carry) which I'll add later. Did you keep her?

Regarding the first offspring with 1vis 1carry, if it was female and if you still have her, I'd start breeding her to the second male. 1vis 1carry equates to 3 trait points which is greater than any of the parents.

Additionally, breeding a 1vis 1carry increases the chances that you'll get a 3carry offspring - she'll contribute 1carry to the next generation (from the 1vis) and has a 50% chance of contributing another carry (from her 1carry) and the male will contribute 1carry (from his 1vis).

T_T i didn't keep her. didn't know that carries could be passed on, i thought they just sorta vanish if they don't have anything to match up with! if i had known that, i probably could've allotted the traits a bit better...if i get a nixi essence in the near future, i'll probably just use it to help myself along a little better, maybe another female but with Stubby and another trait carried.

i'll definitely need to keep track of generations, yeah, i'm thinking the first offspring that works of the A parents will get a B name, the Bs' offspring that's 3carry will be generation C, her kid'll be gen D, etc etc etc...wish there was a more organized way to go about it T_T then i'll either open up a new tab for the second 3vis or. well i'll figure it out when i get the first one!

okay, so yeah, my original plan works more or less, it'll just take centuries OTL i'll need a third stable before i can even consider preparing another project!

thank you so much for all your help, it's just such a complicated process to aim for a specific goal! i'm so used to just randomly breeding and hoping i get a good result, projects are so much more intense! guess it's something to get used to!

There's pretty much a 50% chance that any single carry will be passed on to offspring.

That means if you've got two carries which you're trying to pass to offspring, there would be a 25% chance that the both carries will be passed on to offspring (0.5 x 0.5 = 0.25).

When you breed Medic A (male) and Medic A (female) together in order to get 2 vis, you're actually trying to pass four carries to the offspring (two from mother, two from father) which actually makes the percentage chance 6.25% (0.5 x 0.5 x 0.5 x 0.5 = 0.0625).

When you breed Medic B (male) and Medic A (female) for a 3 carry, you're trying to pass three carries to the offspring (two from mother, one from father). The father is guaranteed to pass a carry on as he has a visible! There is a 25% chance that the mother will pass both her carries on.

The only thing I'd say about naming generations is that it might be helpful to find some way of marking who the parents of any offspring are. This is because, as the project progresses, I would expect that you'd end up breeding Nixis from different generations which can make it complicated.

Projects do take awhile and I'm sure a lot of it is luck. I've been working on a couple of 4 vis projects since early April (with 6 generated parents for each project to help speed up the process). One of the projects I've just now started producing 2 vis, 2 carry offspring. The other project I've only managed to get a two 4 carry (no visible) and they're both related - arrgggghhhh!

A couple of people provided advice to Rabbitaka on how to keep the number of pets for a particular project under control here - https://www.sylestia.com/forums/?thread=26885 - might be worth a read.

You're very welcome and I'm happy to act as a sounding board if you'd like to discuss things further at any point. Good luck with your project!

Yeah, i know that if there's nothing on one parent and a vis on the other, the trait gets carried, but yeah i didn't know about stats or the carries actually coming through!

oh man, that link is HELPFUL. confusing, but helpful. i was thinking something like A1/A2 kind of thing? and trait-wise i was gonna do the lower/upper case thing for hid/vis. the point of the letters was to mark the parents and the generation simultaneously. Once i have two pairs, A and B, i'll start the more complex names, maybe as C1 BB shf, for generation C(first success), parents B and B(male second), and stubby/hermes/feathered carried, at which i can start the loop, and then that'd be...D C1A sHF? C1 for the first offspring of that generation?

alrighty, let's try again(i wrote it out like 5 times and kept screwing up). start with with female C1 BB shf. breed her with A to get D1 C1A sHF. breed female A with male B, get C2 AB shf. then breed D1 and C2 to get E1 D1C2 SHF, the first three vis. get ANOTHER pair from scratch, breed for E2 D2C3 SHF as the opposite gender of E1. ok, that...makes sense, right? if so, then i've already got names and a general plan for how the generations'll go too!

yeah, it takes quite a bit of time! once i get the test kit and another stable i might attempt my next project in conjunction, once i collect the essences for it, since i wanna have something else to do in the meantime, and why not another project once i'm actually used to how they work? not gonna tackle anything bigger than 3vis right now though, but i've got plenty of designs for those all ready. then i can save up for dyes to fix up my pairs, too!

thank you SO much for your help, truly! if you want an offspring of the final pair, i'll gladly reserve one for you, you deserve it!